" Claptrap. "

" Wow John, you actually believe that an entity is punishing this whole country for not believing in him. Funny that a God who loves unconditionally would choose to punish the "masses" rather than simply punish those who don't follow his word. What about all the faithful followers such as yourself who will undoubtedly suffer from "God" raising the price of gasoline and crippling our economy?

If this is the case why is the UAE so prosperous? That country certainly cannot be full of Christians. Is God punishing them with overwhelming wealth?

Your letter is such drivel. It is shallow comments like yours that push me even more towards Atheism. Good day. "

" john...i hate to tell you this. there is no god, and he certainly didn't bless any certain people or country.

countries grow and prosper from whatever natural resources they happen to be able to benefit from. it's all about choice of what you do with those resources. if you were fortunate enough to live here and benefit from what happened to be laying here when a bunch of outcasts, hooligans and criminals came to settle here. this country has prospered from the riches in the land...not some fairy in the sky. "

" The three athiests have spoken!! I guess they think that just settles it for us who believe. I hope I'm able to see when they stand before a Holy God with their dribble! Just to take a peek at their faces when they see He truly "does" exist. Keep up the good articles John. "

" well to say we prospered on our own is true but to say there is no God for sure is a bit over the top, I don't think anyone can prove or disprove that and is silly to try, as for the rest of it I could care less about our similarities to Israel, America has mishandled the Israel situation from the beginning and it has caused us many problems since "

" No DJ, I know that doesn't settle it for anyone who believes. When one's in a cult, rarely does the common sense of the outsiders affect their brainwashed minds. I have stood before your god for the last 40 years waiting for him to say something to me. Not one word uttered...not one rational sign to me. "

" Hey retard, you know the Romans killed Christ in/around 40 AD, right?

So then, just why, did the Roman Empire grown in power over the next 200 years? Why the the Eastern half of the Roman Empire, the ones who oversaw the Cruxifiction of Christ, prosper for the next 1,000 years?

So the USA turns away from God and he starts to punish us within 50 years, but it takes him 1,000 years to fully punish the Romans?

When Christ was killed, the Romans were Pagans! By the time the Roman Empire adopted Christianity, it was in decline.

Dude, you can't go assigning geopolitical events to some mythical, all-powerful, but never visable, being. This is the 21st century, not the 18th century. You want to go live in a cave, fearing god will strike you with a lightning bolt, go find a cave in Afghanistan to dwell in. "

" What's with the name calling?

Is John's beliefs really hurting you that bad? He has his faith, just like you have your faith that Obama can cut taxes for 95% of all America. Trust me, belief in an all-powerful diety is WAY more plausible.

John is right that God hates sin and will punish sin, but it is presumptuous for anyone to declare what is or is not punishment from God. "

" I'm sorry Oblivious. I truly am. I didn't find it easy to become a Christian either, and I still have times when I don't act 100% like a Christian i;e, my comment about wanting to see you stand before God. But, if you want it bad enough, and "allow" yourself to believe, instead of thinking of it as brainwashing, God will show Himself to you. I have never literally "heard" Him either, but I have surely seen miracles in my life
and I know no one else to attribute them to but a mighy God. No one else could do the miracles that have happened for me and to me. You may not like it, and you may not want it, but I'll be praying for you. (No, I don't know who you are, but God does.) "

" What is with the name calling? If you are a moron, you need to be told you are a moron, not treated with kid gloves!

"Because the United States was founded a Christian nation, and for the first 150 years followed these rules, God made us the most powerful and prosperous nation in the world."

First, no we weren't founded as a Christian nation. This is an undisputed fact. Christian zealots have been on a kick to re-write American history -- time after time they are proven wrong, but they keep repeating the same old lies.

Second, America did not become the most powerful and prosperous nation in the world after we created a "so called" Christian nation. In fact, we weren't even a major world player until after 1900.

Supposedly we started to decline 150 years after we were created as a nation -- or 1926. Mind you, this was after 89 years of slavery and 142 years of preventing women from participating in our government. It was not until 1945 that America really came to the front of the world and lay claim to the "most powerful and prosperous nation in the world.

This statement is complete garbage. So we have to treat this person who does not know the first thing about our government, our history, or world history as an equal in the discourse they have so ignorantly brought forward? I don't think so.

You cannot place at best falsehoods, at worst sheer ignorance, on the same level as factual history. The problem is, not enough people have said shut up and these fringe beliefs have gained a foothold in American society. "

" Mr. Calhouns first sentence is the only sentence that carries some TRUTH and SENSE. There are lessons to be learned from Israel, he unfortunately can't see what they are. One that is glaringly obvious is the problem of a religious theocracy. ANother is the problem of ignoring problems (the Palestinian problem) hoping that it will just go away. Another letting the far right nuts take control of your government. Another...... Well maybe someone else would like to add their two bits. "

" This statement is complete garbage. So we have to treat this person who does not know the first thing about our government, our history, or world history as an equal in the discourse they have so ignorantly brought forward? I don't think so.

You cannot place at best falsehoods, at worst sheer ignorance, on the same level as factual history. The problem is, not enough people have said shut up and these fringe beliefs have gained a foothold in American society. """"

thanks Locke....outstanding commentary "

" Yes, Locke has expertly dissected this anti-historical claptrap. "

" John, I think you are pretty much on target. These non-believers who rewrite history to suit their opinions should have their opinions ignored as they only contribute to greenhouse gases. It is these people, most of whom consider themselves superior due to their connection to higher education who are responsible for our public school systems being among the worst in the western world. "

" Sapient you are right about one thing, we do have a public school system that is behind that of many other nations. BUT you misunderstand why. It is that failure to understand why that keeps our system from improving. Don't blame educated people for your lack of an education. We live in the land of Lincoln and Lincoln if you know anything about history was a self-educated man. So there really is no excuse for your ignorance other than your laziness. "

" It seems lately that Ms. Humphreys has loved to take the moral high ground in her posts, what with citing Jesus and all. Odd, how's she is strangely silent as Locke calls someone a "retard" and "moron" for simply stating his views on a public forum, while all the rest of the leftist playground bullies are quick to pat him on the back. "

" The UN divided palestine, in 1947 into two states, one aab and one jewish, to give a national home of jewish people. In 1948 israel declared independence from palestine. They have pretty much been at war, since then.

I am not antisemetic, nor am I against israel.

The UN carved out lands sacred to many cultures and religions, and segregated it for one group to occupy. The entire middle east has been in contention between themselves, for thousands of years. I don't think it was handled right, and no nation should ever be imposed into being like this.

If the world declared Missouri, Illinois, or both an American indian or native american state to call their own. If they forced all land and stuctures to be forfeited along with all the other actions that led to creating israel in the middle of long arab controlled territory, many grudges and outrages over the act and directed at the new occupants, would be prevalent. If they declared independance, closed the borders, and occasionaly expanded or claimed broader teritories, it would be squashed in short order. If they restricted access and trade, by limiting river and highway traffic, it would be widly impacting, and cause more huge resentments.

The history of the state of israel, is far different than the biblical tribes of israel. Jews were always a minority subculture of the middle east, and in 1947, ousiders decided to give them teritory and prominence.

I do not condone the violence, but I do understand its roots. This sort of thing can't be expected to not cause steep hostilities in a region that has been in contention for thousands of years. Solving this created issue is never going to be easy. A few generations of increased tensions hate and resentment, on both sides of the issue have built up since it occured. Our government is the only reason israel hasn't been retaken. We protect, arm, train, and fund, their continued existence in the region. We constantly have been negoiating peace, to try to ease the tensions. Its not the best situation to be in.

Israel's fate rest on America's sucess or failures. The history of Israel has been more than a lesson for the US. If this letters author truly believes we are facing the wrath of god, for iniquities, in an economic crisis created by the greed of men, he must also believe our continual involvement in Israels fate, is facing wrath as well. Believers usually don't see god as vindicive, and one who splits hairs on issues. Thats not the bible I was taught. In the distruction of sodom and gomora, the cities were complete dens on iniquiies, and sins of all natures were commited, openly and without consequnce. He spared his followers, all they had to do was leave and not look back.

Placing gods will on things definatively, tends to be bordering on blasphemy, from my sudies and exposures. Hope for gods will, but assigning it defined specific value in good times or bad, is not in mans pay grade or capacity. Judge not lest ye be judged. Spread the word through love understanding and compassion, not hate, fear, and damnation. Driving sinners further from the fold, with this type of declaration of absolute truth and cast judgements, is not advocated in the bible.

Man has had the freedom of choice, fee will, since the garden of eden, it has been clear, and well established since adam and eve and the snake and the apple. If that is where your belief system is based, where exactly does condeming the nation to the wrath of god, get your cause. Its not for any of us to judge or decide, what gods will is or isn't. Define that within yourself, and share it efectively and apropriately. Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. Eveyone is a sinner, so no one should be judging on gods behalf or in his name. Hate the sins, not the sinners. "

" sapient wrote on Oct 22, 2008 1:00 PM:
It is these people, most of whom consider themselves superior due to their connection to higher education who are responsible for our public school systems being among the worst in the western world. """"

can you define "western world"....is that coles county - east of route 45? "

" "These non-believers who rewrite history to suit their opinions should have their opinions ignored as they only contribute to greenhouse gases."
----
You tell me, Sappy. Where is God mentioned in the Constitution? Has somebody "rewritten" it to irritate you?
History isn't "believed," Sappy. It is fact that is LEARNED. "

" Thank you FB and SH for the enlightenment. I don't know how we would ever get along without you sharing your vast knowledge with us. And thank you TQ. How you enlightened ones ever put up with us is more than I can understand. "

" Where does the constitution say abortion is a right?

where does it say rich people deserve to pay more taxes than anyone else? "

" "And thank you TQ. How you enlightened ones ever put up with us is more than I can understand."
---
You are welcome. It is extremely difficult. "

" "Where does the constitution say abortion is a right?
---
The Ninth Amendment: "The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people."
---
where does it say rich people deserve to pay more taxes than anyone else?
---
The 16th Amendment: "The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration."
---
Glad to be able to educate you, Ed. "

" Pakistan has some lessons for the U.S. too.
---
Missiles thought to have been fired by the US have killed at least eight students of a religious school in north-western Pakistan, witnesses say.
The school, in North Waziristan, is close to the residence of a fugitive Taleban leader, Jalaluddin Haqqani, witnesses told the BBC
Urdu Service.
At least two missiles, reportedly fired by pilotless US drones, hit the school early on Thursday.
The Pakistani army is investigating the incident. The US has made no comment.
The latest missile attack comes hours after the Pakistani parliament unanimously adopted a resolution calling on the government to defend
its sovereignty and expel foreign fighters from the region.
---
Still winning those hearts and minds, I see. "

" Mr. Miller I have "locked horns" with Locke a few times, too bad you weren't paying attention. I admire an honorable opponent. I have also challenged many about their name calling on these pages MANY times. AND yes I take the moral high road, it is easy since so many follow the low road. "

" You are more than welcome Sapient. It is difficult for superior folks to put up with those less so, but we try. After all if we can bring you to our blistful state of enlightened thinking the world will be a better place for ALL. "

" From the San Francisco Chronicle-

(10-22) 19:23 PDT -- Receiving more than $150,000 in clothing and accessories from the Republican National Committee last month doesn't just run counter to Gov. Sarah Palin's image as a "Wal-Mart Mom from Wasilla," it also might have violated the spirit if not the letter of a campaign finance law co-authored by her running mate, Sen. John McCain.

The 2002 McCain-Feingold law prohibits funds that "are donated for the purpose of supporting the activities of a federal or state officeholder" from being used for personal expenses, including clothing, but it doesn't preclude party committees from doing so.

--------------------

Once again McCain flaunts the very rules that he likes to take credit for. While technically not breaking the rules, it certainly give the impression of being a violation of the spirit of the rule. "

" Hey, here's something else we can learn from Israel. They have a cheap, efficient and widely admired national health care system.
I guess it must be endorsed by God, too, right? "

" TQ, all citizens are also guaranteed equal protection under the law.

Having to pay a larger percentage of your income is not equal.

Unborn children do not have the same protections as the rest of us either. "

" sapient wrote on Oct 22, 2008 7:46 PM:
" Thank you FB and SH for the enlightenment. I don't know how we would ever get along without you sharing your vast knowledge with us. And thank you TQ. How you enlightened ones ever put up with us is more than I can understand. """"

now, now little fella....with some hard work and study, you too may be among the enlightened someday. "

" Come on you guys, let a gal have a few perks. She could hardly campaign in the lower 48 in her mukluks and parkas now could she? "

" john...i hate to tell you this. there is no god, and he certainly didn't bless any certain people or country.


Funny, you say there is no God in one sentence and in the same sentence you say he didn't bless anyone,

Well, which is it? "

" Excuse me, I think I'm becoming ill. "

" medic57 wrote on Oct 23, 2008 11:27 AM:
" john...i hate to tell you this. there is no god, and he certainly didn't bless any certain people or country.""

that's right he's 0 for 2....glad you noticed. "

" Mr. Miller "having to pay a larger percentage of your income to taxes" isn't fair it is justice. Justice for those whose who were exploited by their employers. Sure there are those who have come by their wealth innocently, they didn't exploit anyone to get rich, they just inherited wealth. So I guess you might say they are paying for the sins of their fore fathers. "

" Mr. Miller until an unborn fetus can survive on its own the Mothers rights must come first. No ifs, ands or buts. "

" father bob wrote on Oct 21, 2008 11:26 AM:

" john...i hate to tell you this. there is no god

You mean to tell me the the miracle that makes up the billions and billions of the human body just happened, or that all of the stars in the heavens (why do we call it the hevens by the way) are there, they just happened to be there. Or if the Earths orbit to the Sun was 1 foot different one way or the other, we would either be a popsicle or a piece of toast, (scientific fact)

No God -- I think not. There are "scientific facts" we live with every day that cannot be explained by science. In fact, cannot be expalined at all.



A miracle is an event believed to be caused by interposition of divine intervention by a supernatural being in the universe by which the ordinary operation of Nature is overruled, suspended, or modified. The term is derived from Latin word miraculum meaning "something wonderful".Adam Hanley 02 10-23-04 Miracles

Miracles happen all the time. "

" Mr. Miller until an unborn fetus can survive on its own the Mothers rights must come first. No ifs, ands or buts. "


Tell that to the people who are charged withe a double murder of a mother and her unborn child, , if it's not a person yet how can a person be charged? Some unborn "fetuses" as you call them can survive on their own at about 5 months, others, at nine months cannot. "

" Honestly Medic just because something can't be explained doesn't mean that "God did it"! It only means that at this point in time we don't have all the information needed for an explanation, it doesn't mean that the information isn't there. Accidents happen. There isn't any proof that God exists or that he/she once existed and self anilhated at the instant of creation. If you choose to believe that God exists that is your option. "

" Medic I have been over your question with Mr. Miller several times. That law was pushed through by anti-abortion folks hoping it would be a backdoor way to banning abortions. But it didn't work. So blame them for the inconsistency. Actually the anti-abortion folks are inconsistant about many things, death penalty, interference of the government with their medical decisions but they want the government to interfere in the medical decisions a woman makes. So give it up that argument carries no weight. "

" Good going, Medic, you're gonna stir up the snobbish, elitist, leftist, know-it-all, non-believers again. "

" By the way father bob, I was quoting someone else. "