" Yawn. Next topic, please. "

" That reminds me of the time several years ago when a female commissioner made a second on a motion but then corrected herself. She turned to Commissioner Mike Nichols and said, "Im sorry, that was your turn to second a motion". She had strayed from the script made up in "The Little Room" ;o) "

" Invicta, hilarious!

Seriously, got any more of those gems? Surely, if Harry keeps reminding the public of these semi-private caucuses, the Council will mend its ways. Maybe Harry could use some of your material to advance his crusade (with your permission, of course). How about it, Harry? "

" Sounds to me that this "caucus" is just an end round around the open meeting laws. If there are any items being discussed in this caucus that is going to be discussed in open city council, then a pig is a pig. That would be a violation of the open meeting laws. "

" The "Caucus" room, even though they say it's open to the public, so they say, is nothing more than their little hidey hole, to "pre-council" each other.

They ought to grow some cajones, close up shop, & bring "the people's business" to where it truely ought to be heard.

I thought "hide & seek" was a child's game. "

" Perhaps the paper should supply their reporter covering the council circus with a video camera. Film the caucus and the meeting, and any antics can be put up on utube for the public to judge for them selves. Simply closing the caucus room, would just move the keniving to further underground. Phone or internet conferences would replace it being done so brazenly, but those records are often at least subject to subpoena and fredom of information requests. They could have closed circut fed the council chambers, and live fed the "caucus blaucus" procedings if it was really a case of nerves of speaking in public that led to the little room huddles. "

" I would not like calling Travis Owen Jeff. Which I started to do before Herb corrected me.

Was this intentional?

If I remember correctly, this round of cauci started with the previous council because they were discussing the agenda before the meeting without the public and someone pointed out that was in violation of the open meetings act, so they started inviting the public and made it part of the meeting. "

" They don,t believe in the sunshine law? "

" Sue them. If you don't have enough guts, find some. "

" maybe they're having cheese and crackers prior to the council meeting! "

" Surely open meeting acts, dictate someting in regards to acessability to these meetings. Be it handicap, Fire code related room capacities, etc. Perhaps them calling the meeting in the closet, open, is a violation of health and safety standards.

I know this will only lead to the multi million dollar executive city suites of government, and two seperate cathedrals, will be built to hold open but not welcome, and the open to all, House brothers style meetings. Perhaps the fire chief, can inspect the meeting rooms, and pose his take on the Caucus Blaucus sessions. Is it even safe, to let the kids play in the closet like that. Perhaps we need to take the door off of it, to ensure the open door policy. Fire safety is probably being ignored, along with the taxpayers, and the public in general. Call Fire Marshal Bill in, and see wht he thinks about the whole thing. Et me chow ya sumthin. "

" Subgrouping of officials with shared affinities or ethnicities who convene, often but not always to advocate, agitate, lobby or to vote collectively, on policy. "

" A Caucus is needed if Rick Hall is involved. They do need to be scripted. Do any of you remember the scripted meeting on south 9th street when Rick was the president of the school board? 4 of the members each had their timing as to when to speak so they were sure to raise taxes. "

" Mike P, "Perhaps the fire chief, can inspect the meeting rooms, and pose his take on the Caucus Blaucus sessions." LOL Department heads know on which side of the bread is buttered. The Chief is firmly in Commissioner Ervins camp and will say only what the Commissioner tells him to say.

To worry that the descision making will go underground is needless. It is all ready being done behind closed doors long before the question makes it to the caucus room or to the Council chambers. The Open Meetings Act has only been an inconvenience for the Council. They are experts at "splitting hairs" and "skirting the issue". City business will continue to be done behind closed doors out of the public's view. "

" My condolences to Herb for having to face the wrath of the City Council - they should've done THEIR homework!!!

As for Harry's column - amen, Amen, AMEN! The caucus IS a pre-council council meeting so that the powers-that-be can get together, talk about the meeting agenda, look over any prickly points that might cause some problems, and decide how to vote on the issues as to project a unified front. Nothing more, nothing less.

Intimidating? Hello?! Ever tried going up against a group of men who already have their mind's made up about something? Yeah, good luck with that! (If you don't believe me try going up against your male significant other on something he's made up his mind about. Can you say brick wall?!!!)

I'm leaning toward the City Manager form of government simply because of this issue. It's sure a lot easier to face an issue going up against one man rather than the entire defensive line! And one man is easier to fire, if necessary... "

" Might as well, get every angle looked at, and take every one of the entrenched out in one sweeping action. Simply doing it one seat at a time, will leave too many chances of continued meddling by the established folks in charge of things really.

We need candidates of their own mind, to seek these jobs, when the seats do come up. Who in their right mind, would want to step into the mess they made in their little sand box. Its like someone forgot to put the lid on it, in a neighborhood over run with alley cats. These folks are content to play in their clumpy sand, but I wouldn't wish inheriting this nonsense on an enemy, let alone someone I think could actually responsibly represent people. People who have sought and found office here, for quite some time, have had a if things are soo messed up, I am sure to be reelected, for lack of anyone interested in being associated with this mess.

Its time some blame, went to the parties. This nonsense has to stop, and candidates need to bring individual thought to the process. Not be from the shallow pool, several of them share a cigar in, after a long day in the office.

It will take a dozer and truck, and lots of pink slips to undo the doo doo. Several non hackers, are hired. Its a clumpy sandcastle competition, all right, and I don't envy the folks who get to sift the sand when its all over. "

" Why does the City Council have to come look for Harry? Maybe Harry should have attended the meeting. Or maybe Harry should attend a caucus meeting. Herb is a nice guy and doesn't deserve to catch flack for Harry's column, but he is a representitive of the same company Harry works for. Therefore he is placing himself in the cross fire.

I do agree with Harry that there should not be a meeting of the minds prior to the council meeting at 6:30. This issue is easy for the council to take care of if they want to meet prior to the meeting. Go out for coffee in the morning or go out to lunch the day before. There it is fixed! "

" The next time they go into thier hidyhole lock the door from the outside. "

" I agree with Mike P that this council should have a videocamera or tape recorder, maybe even both, to be stored at the public library, so that anyone can look it up, whenever they want. Why the secrecy? You would think that this council was the Bush Admin. or Palin! "

" Great lojack now you will get something started about them all going to lunch at The Villa in tax paid vehicles! lol "

" LOL. I didn't even think about that. "