" Ted Kennedy has spent his life caring for those in need?? Please. Ted Kennedy has spent his life taking care of himself. This is a man who should still be in jail for being responsible for the death of a young girl. He is a giant something that's for sure, but they won't allow me to say it here. "

" He was never enough of a threat to the NWO/Illuminati mongers to qualify for assassination, like his brothers were. "

" Harry you have a warped since of Giants.
He was elite privileged and self serving.
What does Obama know about Chappaquiddick?
Posted: May 22, 2008
1:00 am Eastern

2008
"With Barack Obama," said Ted Kennedy upon endorsing the Illinois senator a few months back, "we will turn the page on the old politics of misrepresentation and distortion."
In his gushing response to Kennedy's endorsement, and in his widely televised anguish about Kennedy's recent illness, Obama shows no sign of understanding what happened in the early morning hours of July 19, 1969, and why the thinking half of America will never forgive Kennedy for it.
To cut to the chase, the 37-year-old Sen. Kennedy drove off a bridge with a young woman in his car, and the woman died. A week after the incident at Chappaquiddick, being a Kennedy, Ted requested and got all three networks to give him 15 minutes of prime time for an unprecedented bit of public dissembling.
An increasingly monolithic major media would allow many a future Democrat moments of extravagant deceit, but none, not even Bill Clinton, would ever match the gold standard Kennedy set that night. What follows are excerpts from that speech, countered by best evidence of what actually happened:

TK: "Only reasons of health prevented my wife from accompanying me [to the party on Chappaquiddick that weekend]."
JC: Ted, in that the party, guests included exactly six married men and six single women in an isolated beach house; it is hard to know how exactly your beleaguered wife would have fit in.
TK: "When I left the party around 11:15 p.m., I was accompanied by one of these girls, Miss Mary Jo Kopechne."
JC: Yea, Ted, 11:15, that's the ticket. The ferry back to Edgartown shut down at 12 midnight, and you were merely driving the pretty 20-something to catch it. Sure! Truth be told, the alibi would have worked a little better had Mary Jo bothered taking her purse, and if a deputy sheriff had not spotted your car with a man and woman in it at 12:40.
TK: "There is no truth whatever to the widely circulated suspicions of immoral conduct that have been leveled at my behavior and hers regarding that evening."

JC: No, you and Mary Jo were driving to the beach alone after midnight to collect seashells. I'll buy that, but did Joan?
TK: "Little over a mile away the car that I was driving on an unlit road went off a narrow bridge."
JC: The road to the ferry to which you were supposedly driving was paved and lit. You knew it well. The road to the beach was unlit and unpaved. You knew that well, too. You have some serious 'splainin' to do, brother.
TK: "Nor was I driving under the influence of liquor."
JC: If the eight or so documented drinks you had taken that day had no influence on you, then we would have to believe you routinely drove off bridges.
TK: "I made immediate and repeated efforts to save Mary Jo."
JC: We have only your word for this, and your word sigh! has less value than the sunken Oldsmobile.
TK: "Although my doctors inform me that I suffered a cerebral concussion as well as shock, I do not seek to escape responsibility for my actions by placing the blame ... on the physical and emotional trauma brought on by the accident."
JC: Any number of witnesses saw you, spry and chatty, walking around Edgarton later that night and the next morning. Of course you sought to escape responsibility with your bogus health claims. Why mention them otherwise? Why wear a neck brace?
TK: "I made an effort to call a family legal adviser, Burke Marshall, from a public telephone on the Chappaquiddick side of the ferry, and then belatedly reported the accident to the Martha's Vineyard police."
JC: You made a documented 17 long distance calls to lawyers and advisers before talking to the police. And it was the police who called you after a fisherman found your car the next morning. "Belatedly" indeed!
TK: "No words on my part can possibly express the terrible pain and suffering I feel over this tragic accident. "

" Thank you for your well thought out editorial, Harry. If this article was about George Bush, despite the fact that I have absolutely no respect for him, as a politician, I would hope that I would have the decency to not use this forum to attack the man, if he were felled by such a serious malady. All of us who post on here on a regular basis are well aware of each others politics, and there are ample threads to express those thoughts. And so I find it rather in poor taste to read some of the things posted on this particular thread. I wondered if there would be someone who lacked the decency to be able to refrain from posting their hateful spleen on this piece. I was not really surprised at who it turned out to be.

George Bush, John McCain, John Cornyn were three Republicans quoted by Harry, who showed some class. It's too bad the locals couldn't do the same. "

" Just out of curiosity, will you two dance on his grave with equal glee. Give us break, the man will likely be dead in a matter on months.

If I were an opponent of the Kennedy's, I would be embarrassed by the comments I read on here today. "

" Amen, Early Bird! "

" The statements made are about the amazement of the story trying to make a hero out of a person who has made a mockery of justice and flaunted the law his entire life. If anybody else had done some of the things Ted Kennedy has done they would have been in jail most of their lives. Ted Kennedy is not a hero. As far as comments about George Bush, there have been time and again comments just as inappropriate mentioned on a daily basis by certain people who seem to have nothing else to do in their life but cruise these sections. No, I will not dance on Ted's grave when he is gone, but I will also not miss his slanted view on issues and his idea that he is above the law. During the Clarence Thomas hearings, a comedian said,"People ask me where I get my material. I am sitting here watching Ted Kennedy judging somebody elses morals. Where do you think I get my material. I am not a George Bush fan. Early bird, I find it interesting that people with your views think it is all right to say anything about anyone, because it is your right(which it is). But the minute anyone says something about someone you support, it is always a disgrace and you all whine like little babies. I am sure this will bring responses from some of your cronies so you won't have to stand alone on this issue. "

" I wonder if just wondering and 1 cav are Christians. If so, a few thoughts come to mind: "Judge not that ye be not judged," "Whatsoever you do to the least of your brethren you do unto me," and we are all sinners in the eyes of God. Through His grace and mercy, and the blood shed on the cross by His Son, we are forgiven of those sins, no matter how dark they may be. I believe in the power of redemption. Ted Kennedy has accomplished more for the good of America than any of us posters ever will, particularly for the least among us in society, the poor, the sick, the weak, and the voiceless. In addition to helping the poorest in society, he has also done much for the average, middle-class American. If you ever need to take an extended leave of absence from work to care for a sick parent or child, thank Ted Kennedy for the comfort of knowing you have a job to go back to after caring for your family member. If you are a college student or graduate and received a Pell Grant to help you afford your college education so that you could go out and make a difference in the world, thank Ted Kennedy. If you are a working class American who has benefitted from increased wages over the past 46 years, thank Ted Kennedy. If you are a person who is tired of political gridlock and partisan bickering, thank Ted Kennedy for reaching across the aisle all these decades. The list of things Ted Kennedy has done for you and me is long and runs deep into American life. But even if that were not true, how classless do you have to be to dwell on a man's failings at a time like this? I was one of the most vocal critics of Ronald Reagan of anyone I knew, but from the moment he announced his Alzheimers until his death, I never bad-mouthed him again. I am no fan whatsoever of George Bush, but if he were facing this diagnosis, my Bush-bashing would cease, and even Bush has had the class to say nothing but supportive remarks about Sen. Kennedy since his cancer diagnosis. I hope Sen. Kennedy beats the odds and returns to the Senate. He has a lot of unfinished business there on our behalf, and there is no one in our government more capable of championing the cause of the common man. Godspeed, Teddy. My thoughts and prayers are with you and your family. "

" And one more thought for Just Wondering. Other than the car accident at Chappaquiddick, what has Ted Kennedy done that would warrant spending most of his life in jail? The events involving Mary Jo Kopechne's death are indeed tragic, and I do not excuse Sen. Kennedy for what happened. Of course, he should have called for help, and of course he should have reported the accident. But the likelihood is that even if he had run to the first available house after freeing himself from the water, by the time the authorities and a dive team would have arrived at the scene, Ms. Kopechne would have already been gone. Even though he didn't do this, his reckless actions that night were a far cry from murder or anything that would warrant prison time. Didn't Laura Bush also kill someone while driving drunk many years back? And let's compare stats with our wonderful leader right now: Ted Kennedy: a suspected DUI, lies to authorities, and a dead young woman. George W. Bush: convicted of DUI, admitted drug abuse, lies to the American people, and 4,000 dead U.S. soldiers (plus countless Iraqi citizens). Let's look at the other side of the ledger: redeeming things they've done for America. Ted Kennedy: a list too long to mention (see Harry's article, my earlier post, and numerous other sources for a full accounting). George W. Bush: a miserably failed presidency that has our country on the brink of ruin. "

" You are so right on your post about these whiners that don't like it when you talk about someone they like,but it's okay for them to spew their garbage on here. Early Bird and Rotty and alot of others don't like it when they have to eat crow. These guys are a dime a dozen out there. Glad somebody put them in their place(THE GARBAGE CAN) "

" Tammer yes I am a Christian. As I read the good book though, to achieve redemption, you first must confess your sins and turn your life away from that kind of life. Mr. Kennedy has never taken one bit of responisbility for his actions that nightor for any other. The way his family used their power to circumvent the truth coming out is not what I consider to be heroic actions. Strong rumors had it that the girl was pregnant, but things were covered up and the body buried before any kind of autopsy was done. There is not enough room here to list all the shady tactics used by this "giant" to avoid prosecution. This one matter alone is enough to eliminate the title of "giant" from him. What Ted Kennedy has been his entire life is a lawmaker who thinks the laws do not apply to him and his family. He has used his family's wealth and position to avoid taking responsibility for his actions. Has he championed some causes that have been good for people? Yes. Last time I checked though that was supposed to be his job. I would say though that the reason he did most of those things were for votes not because it was the right thing to do. Also, I am not a George Bush fan. My leanings used to be more toward the Democratic side of things. But the Democratic party has forgotten the people that have been the backbone of the party for years. The are more interested in the gay rights and abortion rights people than they are those who were in the party for years. Some have stayed even though they strongly disagree with the liberal stances, because they are not comfortable with the Republicans either. I find it interesting that most people feel that if you don't care for one person in a particular party, you must be a supporter of the other party. Both parties have their good people and bad. As long as we have people looking at labels like Republican and Democratic we will never get anywhere. We need people who can see the good even if it comes from the other side of the aisle. It would be interesting if both parties were abolished and each person had to run on their individual merits. There is no way you can tell me that just because someone is from a certain party he or she is the best candidate. A few years ago this county was a perfect example of that. Anyone who voted a straight party ticket voted for someone who was not the best candidate for that office.
"

" I sincerely hope Teddy Kennedy gets either a miracle or manages to live his remaining time here as pain-free and prosperous as he can be. I've no love for the man and I certainly disagree with almost everything he stands for politically, but why kick a man when he's down?

There is flowery rhetoric that inevitably follows anyone's death, and I'm sure Senator Kennedy will be no different. However, now is the time for support and encouragement not just for the Senator, but for his family. There is a human need to remember those we love not for the bad things but for the good. Should his family be denied that? History will be the ultimate judge of Ted Kennedy, not those of us here on this board. "

" tammer65, if not at the top, you have to be near the top of the '2008 dumbest poster list'. You say "Didn't Laura Bush also kill someone while driving drunk many years back?" No, tammer65, in fact, she didn't kill anyone while driving drunk many years back! Ever hear of snopes.com? A typical emotional gender-bender lib, you throw totally irresponsible statements around, and then wait for someone to correct you - after the damage is done? // As to Harry's piece on TK, it wasn't much on substance actually - made up primarily of quotes from other people. Probably about the most boring thing Harry has written in a long time. The only thing that got my attention was the following paragraph (which surely needed editing of some sorts - it made no sense at all). "When President Kennedy of Camelot was killed in Texas Teds older brother Robert took up the sword. He was followed in death by Ted." WHAT? As far as I know, Ted is still alive! He's the one we're all writing about here. John died, then Robert, then Mary Jo Kopechne is the one who died, at poor Ted's hands. Remember now? Ted is a drunken, pampered bum who is finally getting his just deserves! Honestly, I hope he goes slowly and painfully and then rots in hell. "

" Just wondering, you are absolutely right in saying that I am the first to complain when I think someone is trying to curtail some one's right to speak their mind.

We see that done on a regular basis on this site, and yes, along with the spelling and grammar police, it is a pet peeve of mine.

However, I think you misinterpreted my message completely.


My complaint was in the place you chose to make your feelings known. There is a time and a place for everything.

No, just wondering, I would have said the same thing if you and 1 cav had chosen to vent your spleen onto someone I have no respect for. I thought I made that point clear in my first message.

-------------------------

Tammer65, It was good to see that you got it.

I also find it rather amusing that in his rant, that only one thing could be found to justify all of his hatred was the tragic accident where someone lost their life. If he had flaunted the law his entire life, one would think numerous example would have been sited. The lack of that speaks volumes.

All too often, there are those that refuse to acknowledge the good things a person does and are so blind in their hatred that all they can see are that persons failures.

I have also noticed that hatred and indignation over an other's actions usually follow party lines, and I think is an example that illustrated that point rather clearly.

Lastly, I have to wonder what our Kennedy critics think should have happened to Laura Bush for her accident, that was caused by her driving while drunk. Should she have been put in prison for the rest of her life too? "

" EB, gringa is right. You people spread these leftist lies, and then by the time someone corrects you, the damage is done. Laura Bush WAS NOT driving while drunk. It was an car accident that happened at 8:00 PM (in the dark). She ran a stop sign. She hit a car. The boy was thrown from the car, and he died. There was no booze involved. Unlike Kennedy, she didn't try to come up with a cover story. Unlike Kennedy, she was 17; he was 37. Unlike Kennedy, she was remorseful then and still is today. "

" To Gringa: this is from snopes.com, the very source you mentioned for checking facts:

"In May 2000 a two-page police report pertaining to a fatal car accident near Midland, TX in 1963, was made public. It contained the information that 17 year-old Laura Welch (her maiden name) had run a stop sign, causing the death of the only occupant of the car her vehicle had struck. According to that report, the future First Lady had been driving her Chevrolet sedan on a clear night shortly after 8 p.m. on 6 November 1963 when she entered an intersection without heeding the stop sign and there collided with the Corvair sedan driven by 17-year-old Michael Douglas."

What made this even more horrific is that, according to the Snopes site, the boy's father was driving in the car behind him and witnessed his son's death. The snopes site also noted the strong character and bright potential of the victim -- just as much was lost in this tragic, death at the hands of a reckless driver as was lost with Ms. Kopechne's death at the hands of a reckless driver.

The snopes column also notes that Ms. Welch and her passenger were on their way to a party at the time. It also notes that while the police report states that neither drivers were drinking, no tests were performed to confirm that fact and that no charges were filed.

Hmmm. No tests were run to determine if the driver in a fatal crash had been drinking. No charges were filed -- even though she had clearly run the stop sign, causing this young man's death. That sounds a little fishy to me.

And Gringa, being called "the dumbest poster of 2008" by the likes of you is a badge I'll proudly wear. The idiotic comments you routinely make on here speak very loudly for themselves, so loudly that if I were ever to be praised by you it would make me want to vomit. So thanks for the comment. I take it as praise, along the lines of one of my favorite poets (someone you're too uneducated to probably have ever heard of and a quote you probably are incapable of understanding), William Blake, who wrote, "Listen to the fool's reproach! It is a kingly title!" "

" To Just Wondering: how do you know that Kennedy hasn't confessed his sins? Are you God? The Good Book doesn't require confessions to man, but to God, in order to be forgiven and redeemed. And Ted DID accept responsibility for the death and apologize to the Kopechne family and to the American back in 1969. He also made a public apology for the flaws in his personal life back in 1992. How do you know he hasn't been forgiven? As far as turning his way from that behavior, many reports have noted that he HAS turned his personal life around since his second marriage in 1993. As far as your "strong rumors that Mary Jo Kopechne was pregnant" comment, are we really supposed to judge others at all, let alone on the basis of rumors? That ugly comment not only smears Sen. Kennedy but also does great injustice to the character and memory of Mary Jo Kopechne, the young woman you claim to want justice for in your original post. "

" Gringa, you show what kind of person you are by saying that "Ted is a drunken, pampered bum who is finally getting his just deserves! Honestly, I hope he goes slowly and painfully and then rots in hell." How can anyone with even a shred of decency in them wish this kind of thing for another human being? "

" I haven't posted on this once, yet, but I'm going to now.
LOL!
While I'm no T.K. fan, either, I do hope for the best, for the man.
Nobody should have to go through the ills, or encounter the likes of, or have to endure cancer.
My family has been effected greatly by cancer, & eventually, it'll probably nail me as well, but I'm trying to work on a better future, as we all are, & hopefully I won't have to go through what so many others have had to.
We all try to learn, as we go through life, then we take that knowledge & procede forward, & try to give back some, as we go, before it becomes our time to meet our maker.
And speaking of giving, I'm going to give some back now.
LOL!
mjgtm, a little bit hypocritical in your post, eh?
Looks like you're the one doing some whining, right now.
Eating crow?
Nah, I think I'll stick to chowing on you posters who live in a unrealistic world, who do nothing more than to constantly post your inane drivel, only to find out, in the end, that what your dissatisfied with, has been what several of us have tried to get through your thick skulls all along.
May I suggest you return to the Abernathy/Reardon threads, & continue to misunderstand the info given to you there, by the redneck rebels, then eventually, maybe, you'll have a better understanding for the need of File 13, but then again, probably not.
I will end by saying I wish Mr. Kennedy well, & also hope for a full recovery. "

" Chad (USAF), Once again, you've shown that you are a class act through your posts! You and I are often on opposite sides of an issue, but even so, you routinely show great logic and insight in what you say. This time around, though, you've added "compassion" to the list. We need more of that in the world! "

" Gee EB, you are not comparing apples to apples. No one died, or as some have suggested killed, when Laura Bush and when George were charged with DUI. Both were charged with the crimes they committed. If you or I were driving drunk and someone was killed in the accident do you think we would have gotten the same treatment as Ted Kennedy? If you do you must have some tremendous connections that most of us don't. There were several law enforcement agencies in this incident that looked the other way to allow him to walk free. As I said there are too many instances of Ted and other family members too mention where their celebrity gave them special treatment. I am not happy that anyone has the health problems he has. My problem is trying to basicly make a saint out of a man who is nowhere close to that status. You also need to read a little closer EB. No where have I ever said that anyone's right to speak their mind should be curtailed. I just said that if you are going to speak your mind, then don't complain when others speak theirs. It is everyone's right to speak their mind. I defend your right to do it, even if I don't agree with you. Finally once again you feel that everything has to do with party lines. As I stated earlier I am not a member of either party and have probably voted for more Democrats in my lifetime than I have Republicans. You are too stuck up on labels and that is why nothing gets done in politics. There are Republicans that I disagree with as strongly as I do Ted Kennedy. "

" Actually, gringa, a lot of people have speculated as to whether or not Laura Bush was drinking or not. The Snopes.com site says that no tests for alcohol were performed after the accident. Does that rule out the possibility she was drinking? I don't think so. In those days there was not the awareness of alcohol abuse as there is today, so the fact that someone was not tested should not surprise anyone. The fact that she later married a congenital liar, with a alcohol and cocaine problem of his own throws a little bit of suspicion her way.

Having lived in the Midland/Odessa area during that time period, I can tell you Laura had quite a reputation as a party girl. As they say, it was drugs, sex and rock and roll, and Laura was not immune to any of it. A lot of us were really surprised that the Bush family would accept her, given her party girl reputation and all. Most of the girls George got pregnant were paid to have abortions.

Who knows, perhaps George married her for her dealer connections.

And while we're on the subject of degenerates, does anyone know what the VP's wife, Lynn's steamy lesbian sex novels are going for on E-Bay?

Oh, those Republican family values.

For a continuation of the last 7 years be sure to vote for John McCain. (I've got a whole lot of good stuff on his wife too, and I'll be sure to share it if McCain gets elected)..... "

" Has the Bush/Cheney duo filed for moral bankruptcy yet? "

" I guess Tom Andres was there that night. If no tests for alcohol were administered then how can he say (rather emphatically, I might add) that she was not? In reality, I suspect this was just another one of Tommy's wild a$$ assumptions that he is so famous on here for.

Tom did you actually read what EB said?

Now read this real slow, Tom, the point some are making is not about the criticism, but merely attaching those comments to an article about his having been diagnosed with a life threatening brain tumor, get it now?

You say gringa was right, was he also right about the slow painful death and the rotting in hell part too? Is that an example of compassionate conservatism?

And by the way if this article had been about George Bush having a similar illness, those comments would have just as disgusting and reprehensible.

I suspect you just jumped to conclusions, like you usually do, when you read the posters name.

I have often disagreed with Chad (USAF) on many occasions, but was glad to see his classy post here on this subject. Chad gets it, and others could learn by his example.

I'm still waiting for that long list of evils that Ted Kennedy has perpetrated on the American public, just wondering. You've had a couple of days to come up with it, where is it at?
"

" tk "

" wasn't there a double decker rape TK and a fellow senator committed in an upper room of a restaurant? "

" This is for Rotty
I only hope that you were telling the truth for once by saying that cancer will probably get you also!! Can't wait for the day it happens!!!!!!! "

" Just Wondering, you say that "there are too many instances of Ted and other family members too mention where their celebrity gave them special treatment" as evidence on why we should hate Ted Kennedy. Since when are we accountable for the behavior of our nephews or nieces or cousins? If anything, that bad behavior by other relatives has only made people look more harshly at Teddy (and is that a fair thing to do?) rather than resulting in him "getting away" with anything. You also claim in another post that the good things that Kennedy has done should just be accepted as part of his job and that he only did it to get votes. Two thoughts here -- 1) if it's just doing what he's supposed to be doing, why don't other Senators have equally impressive accomplishments on behalf of the American people. Strom Thurmond served in the Senate until he was in his late 90's, perhaps even 100, but for the life of me I can't think of a single thing he accomplished for average folks. And before you accuse me of being partisan, Sen. Robert Byrd, D-WVa, has served longer than Kennedy but without accomplishing as much. 2) If it was just pandering for votes, why would he propose things that raised people's taxes, since cutting taxes seems a sure-fire way to ingratiate oneself to the voters and since raising them is unpopular? Why would he fight so hard for Civil Rights, when those bills have cost the Democratic Party the South since 1964? Hardly popular positions for someone just out to get votes, and those are but 2 examples. As Chad (USAF) said, history will be what judges Sen. Kennedy, not any of us posting here. I happen to believe that history will smile favorably upon Sen. Kennedy, flaws and all, for what he has accomplished on behalf of the American people. It's my great hope that his health will allow him to accomplish still more. "

" mjgtm, apparently you've never watched a loved one have to suffer and die from cancer, or you wouldn't be able to wish that upon anyone. I watched my mom battle colon cancer for 4 1/2 years, coupled with ovarian cancer in the last year of her battle, and it was an agonizing thing for her to endure. (All the more reason that I feel sympathy for Sen. Kennedy and his family -- brain cancer would have to be one of the worst cancers to have. At least my mom didn't lose her ability to speak to us, or to understand us when we told her we loved her, or to see the sunshine or a vase of flowers, or to walk or even move her arms or legs, during her battle the way many brain cancer victims do.) Why would you say that about someone else? Because you don't like the things they post on online forums? I'll admit, I get about as fired up as anyone on these threads, but puh-lease! Wishing that someone would get cancer, die an agonizing death to boot, because their opinions differ from yours???? It's frightening to think there are such angry, venomous people allowed to roam the streets. (Anyone wonder now why some of us prefer to use on-screen names?) "

" Rape, murder, who cares as long as he cares for the poor.............while he is sailing on his yaht. "

" Just Rotty, nobody else! He is a worthless piece of garbage "

" 1957, better to care for the poor while sailing on a yacht than not to care for the poor at all while sailing on one's yacht, or while riding in a pickup on one's ranch to appear like you're one of the common folk even though you have more money and rich, powerful friends than the Kennedys and even though you've done more to hurt the poor and middle class than any president since Hoover. . . . BTW, not that facts matter to any of your ilk, but car accidents don't equal murder, not even if you fail to summon help, and the Senator has never been accused of raping anyone. If you're going to bad-mouth a dying man, at least get your facts straight. "

" If the shoe fits, wear it "

" Tammer65, I am so sorry to hear about the loss of your mother, and that she had to suffer so much before she died. Years ago, I worked as a research assistant in a study set at an oncology clinic; my job was to interview patient volunteers about their doctors' visits. I was impressed each day by the grace and courage of the people who allowed me to interview them. As sick and upset as they often were, they took the time to participate in the study because they thought they would be helping someone down the line. Anyway, Tammer, I honor your mother's memory.

President Kennedy was revered by many in West Virginia, and I remember the day he was shot. I was six at the time. I also remember the hopes many had for R. Kennedy going into that last summer, and the shock of his death. Though my parents did not talk much about the Chappaquiddick incident, I picked up a real sense of the shame and disdain that engulfed T. Kennedy after it happened. I respect what T.K. has done over the years to make this country a better place and certainly will be praying for him and his family. "

" Tammer, I apologize.....murder was a little harsh....more like involutary manslaughter and leaving the scene of an accident, plus driving while intoxicated. There.....now we are talking accurate.....most normal citizens of this country would get significant jail time for "activity". oh and let me add screwing around while married....oops not a crime just a morality issue and violating one of the commandments. There is plenty of money in the Kennedy clan to cover up most anything. "

" Did I strike a direct nerve, mjgtm?
Here's a tissue for you, even though you seem to care so much for my health & well-being.
I'll make sure I'm around here for a long long time to come, just to personally help you & your kind through any indifferences.
May I assist you in thumbing through the phone book for a good psychiatrist?
You sound like you need some serious help.
I'd like to also suggest you not spend as much time in the back room, at the Ice House, you might find differing opinions easier to swallow than the swill you currently indulge in, with the company you keep.
Now, start thumbing through the Yellow Pages, help is only a phone call away.
Truth be known, I really do care, & I'm always here to help. "

" I thought I had seen everything. I know there are some sad and pathetic people in this world, but could anyone possibly get any lower than the poster who said he hopes another dies of cancer. Tom Andres said he agreed with another who made similar remarks, so I wonder if Tom agrees with this person too? I would hope that Tom would disassociate himself with these remarks.

Yes tammer, I agree that it would be rather foolish using your real name on here as long as there are people out there filled with such hatred and venom. "

" Tammer, I too lost my mother to cancer several years ago. I know that she suffered excruciating pain in her last few days, and can't for the life of me understand why one human being would wish that on another. My wife has lost relatives to cancer too, and is well aware of the pain and suffering this terrible disease causes. "

" VTucker, EB, and HP, thanks for the kind words and support. Cancer is the kind of scourge that no one, and I mean no one -- even those confined to prison for life, like some posters wish would have happened to T. Kennedy -- no one should have to endure that kind of suffering. Wouldn't the world be a better place if we spent more time looking for the good around us than shredding each other for the bad? "

" One last thought: it seems we've forgotten the original intent and purpose of Harry's article: that political giants who reach across the aisle and actually get things accomplished are literally a dying breed -- to all our detriment, and that as Americans we typically come together in times like this, as noted by the praise and compassion shown to Ted Kennedy from conservatives as well as liberals, Democrats and Republicans and independents alike. If we lose that ability, we also lose the ability to move people forward. I've been reading a lot about Kennedy since this diagnosis and think a couple of things bear repeating. The father of a young man from Massachusetts, a staunch Republican, was stunned when he looked up as they were burying his son -- killed in Iraq -- at Arlington National Cemetery and saw Ted Kennedy there to offer his sympathy at the loss. He asked the father about his son, and learned that his death could partially be attributed to the lack of armor for his humvee. The very next week, Sen. Kennedy introduced legislation that required the humvees to be armored and got it done -- protecting the lives of countless of our servicemen and women serving in Iraq. Another was from the mother of a two-year-old with the same kind of brain cancer Ted Kennedy has. She was with her son in a hospital room a few floors below the Senator's room at Massachusetts General Hospital. She was explaining that there was hope for her young son because of a clinical trial funded in part through Sen. Kennedy's tireless fight on behalf of cancer research funds. I saw 2 similar stories from families using facilities at the Mayo Clinic in Minnesota and at the University of Chicago, so it's not just the East Coast benefiting, but people all over America. I'm sure the last thing on the mind of that 2 year-old's mother was Mary Jo Kopechne. If we want to find the bad in people, we don't have to look very hard. Most of us will never come close to accomplishing all the good that people like Ted Kennedy have done, despite his mistakes. "

" my mother died of pancreatic cancer 3 years ago.

i would wish that on anyone. "

" Like Rotty, I'm not a huge fan of Ted Kennedy. BUT to wish the kind of pain on him along with Rotty and others) who don't hold with "mjgtm's" hateful comments toward them is beyond sick! While I don't always go along with Ted Kennedy's ultra liberal( my opinion) agenda, he HAS done many things that have been of great service and help to many in our country.

Good for you Rotty, and all the other posters who stood up to this hatefulness. I too have seen what cancer can do to family members and friends. No way would I wish it on anyone.

Chad(USAF) stated it simply and eloquently on May 25th @ 10:19PM. I don't see how to improve on what he wrote. "

" Tammer65 - "it sounds fishy to me" - who are you kidding? You want to believe that Laura Bush (nee Welch) was drunk because you want to make a point that a republican made a similar mistake as a democrat. I frequently enjoy your posts, because often you do appear to be fair and logical, but on this one you are running purely on emotion. Ted Kennedy has done a lot for this country and I am very sorry that he has cancer. That is no reason to try and besmirch others to support someone you believe in. I'm disappointed in you. "

" Thanks, Billie.
;-)
Amen, Chad(USAF)'s post is a class act.
My thoughts & prayers go out to anyone that's had to, or will have to, deal with cancer. "

" Beaches, sorry I disappointed you, but I think privilege cuts both ways. Laura Bush was from a prominent family, and it does sound like she was treated differently, not only with no DUI, but not even a citation for running a stop sign. If fair is fair, people just assume Kennedy was driving drunk, but there's no concrete proof of that, either. I do think my emotions are running high here because of the sick posts that have been made about a dying man. I don't regret defending him. "

" Oops -- that should have read "no DUI tests performed." My point is that people don't vilify her for her reckless actions that resulted in death, but they'll vilify Teddy Kennedy for his reckless actions that resulted in death -- even vilifying him as he's battling brain cancer. Personally, I'd be for forgiving both -- both have moved past their mistakes. I personally think Teddy's done more for the country than Laura Bush has, but he's had a better forum for bringing about change. I was indeed attempting to remind a few Republicans that mistakes -- even ones resulting in deaths -- happen regardless of politicians. I thought it was an appropriate example of that. "

" Oops -- regardless of political affiliation (not politicians, as I posted). Time to pull the plug -- I've said all I can say to try to defend a man that I'll believe with my last breath is worth defending. "

" Let's be honest here. When it comes to arrests related to alcohol violations, the Bush family has to hold some sort of a record. Between Daddy George (3 or 4 DUI's, arrest for theft and coke bust) and Mama Laura (DUI and vehicle manslaughter) and the good time party girls, Jenna (2 liquor arrests) and Barbara ( 3 alcohol arrests), no family could come close to their record. Getting arrested for some sort of alcohol related incident seems to be a family value with that tribe. The only other family that comes close might be Georges brother, Jeb's family. While the George bunch seems to have pretty well limited most of their arrests to alcohol violations, Jeb's bunch runs the gamut from illegal drug prescription forging, smuggling jewels past customs, criminal damage to personal property and public lewdness and more. What a family. They make the Kennedy's look like a bunch of choir boys. I have to wonder if those two families should rot in jail too? How about it, gringa, mjgtm and just wondering? I never heard from any of you as to what should happen to Laura for killing that young man in Texas. You know the case where she wasn't even charged. It seems like people from influential families get a way with a lot, don't they? It's happened right here in Coles county too. "

" tammer65 wrote on May 24, 2008 10:29 PM:
" I wonder if just wondering and 1 cav are Christians. If so, a few thoughts come to mind: "Judge not that ye be not judged,"tammer65 wrote on May 24, 2008 10:38 PM: As far as your "strong rumors that Mary Jo Kopechne was pregnant" comment, are we really supposed to judge others at all, let alone on the basis of rumors?Hmmm. No tests were run to determine if the driver in a fatal crash had been drinking. No charges were filed -- even though she had clearly run the stop sign, causing this young man's death. That sounds a little fishy to me.

And Gringa, being called "the dumbest poster of 2008" by the likes of you is a badge I'll proudly wear. The idiotic comments you routinely make on here speak very loudly for themselves, so loudly that if I were ever to be praised by you it would make me want to vomit. So thanks for the comment. I take it as praise, along the lines of one of my favorite poets (someone you're too uneducated to probably have ever heard of and a quote you probably are incapable of understanding), William Blake, who wrote, "Listen to the fool's reproach! It is a kingly title!" "George W. Bush: convicted of DUI, admitted drug abuse, lies to the American people, and 4,000 dead U.S. soldiers (plus countless Iraqi citizens).
How does the title HYPOCRITE sound? "

" If raising similar examples about Republicans to point out the one-sidedness of you and gringa make me a hypocrite, sign me up. "

" Tammer65:

We agree on one thing - no one should vilify another who is facing such a diagnosis - my personal feelings aside (and actually, I think Ted Kennedy has made some bad decisions in his personal life, but so have we all)I pray for his health, and hope that things go as well for him as possible when facing this. I believe that he does care for people, that he has dedicated his life to helping others (again, although I don't always agree with his politics), the Kennedy's were raised to believe in giving back, and he has done so.

Harry Potter:
As for the comment about the Bush family - I am certain that if we look closely at our own families, there are many mistakes and flawed individuals. To take such glee in pointing this out in others is really ridiculous. Any family that lives their life in the public eye has to deal with publicly what most of us deal with privately. "

" Well said, Beaches. And just for the record, I agree that Kennedy has made many mistakes in his personal life. "

" Beaches, the Kennedy's were NOT "... raised to believe in giving back ..." Joe taught them that second place is worth nothing in this world. Joe taught them to take whatever they wanted. Maybe you should read up on the Kennedy family. Without exception, they're a ruthless bunch. Where have you been? "

" Gringa:

I've been in education, thanks. And I have read up on the Kennedy's, and don't disagree that they are ruthless. But, I see people as more than one dimensional beings - and although they certainly did take very good care of themselves, most of the Kennedy's (especially the older ones) also felt a strong obligation to give back to society. History often shows that some of the most brutal and ruthless people had a very different side with others. So, learning about people, cultures and history is where I've been - what about you? "

" I'm still waiting on a list of all of the evil things the Kennedy's have done. It seems that all of the Kennedy haters can come up with is the accident that took the life of a young woman.

Is that it? Is that all you have?

I would think it would be easy, after all some, like gringa, just wondering and 1 cav have said Kennedy has spent his entire life flaunting the law.

How about some examples?

Here gringa, I'll even help you. I believe a couple of Kennedy cousins were arrested. One for murder and one for rape. The murder charge stuck, that guy is in prison, and the rape charge proved to be untrue, and we all know this must have been Teddy's fault too. LOL!!

I have given several example of criminal action on the part of the Bushes. And find it rather telling that not one thing I have said, about that tribe, has been disputed.

It's just too darn easy to come up with example after example of unethical, illegal or stupid behavior with that bunch of reprobates, the Bushes.

I think it might be time for an update on Bushes brother, Neil, the one that cost us tax payers millions of dollars, and never spent a second in jail for his crimes. More about him later.

So why can't gringa do the same thing for the Kennedys?

Gringa, as usual, throws out comments that he can't support, such as they are a ruthless bunch. Pure conjecture and no facts to support the claim.

I suppose it's easier to attack tammer for her passion, which I, and I suspect many others, admire.

Yeah, insulting tammer goes a long way in making a point, huh, gringa?

If you want to read about a truly ruthless bunch, read up on the Bushes, starting with the Nazi connections and business dealings of Prescott Bush all the way to the current idiot and lying piece of scum occupying the White house. "

" While I neither like nor respect Ted Kennedy, I certainly don't wish harm to him, either. I wanted to see him exit politics, but not like this. I wouldn't wish cancer on anyone. "

" HP, actually the "Kennedy cousin" with the murder conviction is only related to the children of Robert Kennedy and isn't even a Kennedy at all; he's Michael Skakel, nephew of Robert's wife Ethel Skakel Kennedy. Beaches made a good point earlier about how living in the fish bowl magnifies everything this family does -- good, bad, or even by association.

Good post, even stephen. I have no problem with the fact that there are those who dislike Teddy Kennedy -- his personal life has left him wide open to criticism, and many don't like his liberal politics. If there had only been posts like yours, I'd have probably kept my opinions about Ted Kennedy to myself. But what got me so riled up were people who felt the need to vilify a dying man. I felt the need to balance out those attacks. "

" Sorry, Mr Potter. Didn't mean to get under your skin. LOL You say "Yeah, insulting tammer goes a long way in making a point, huh, gringa?" I'm only following your lead, Harry. Isn't that what we're supposed to do on here - insult people? Isn't that why we use screen names - so we can get away with unfounded allegations about anyone we choose? (Take a look at some of Early Bird's wild accusations at some of the local folks running for office. You'll see what I mean. Ha, and then he gets all beside himself if someone challenges him. what a fake old blowhard.) I think it's hilarious that some of the screen names on here get all bent out of shape if one of their silly posts is assailed. It's like they take it personally when, literally, that's quite impossible. How can a screen name be 'insulted'? // Anyway, I still say Ted Kennedy is a drunk scumbag rich kid who deserves a slow painful death. Kind of poetic, isn't it? Ask Mary Jo's family about her slow painful death at the hands of that coward. What goes around, comes around. "

" Thanks for the correction, tammer. I was merely attempting to help the Kennedy bashers out a little, you know sort of like priming the pump. LOL! I have a hunch I will be waiting for a while for the answer to my question addressed to them to them.

PS, I enjoyed your comments, especially the one about the armor plating for the Humvees. That little story illustrates the Kennedy that some people refuse to acknowledge exists. They prefer to dwell on a stupid mistake he made over 40 years ago. One poster even talked about the remorse that Laura Bush lives with for he part in an accident that took a life, but none of the Kennedy bashers are willing to concede that he might also feel a lot of remorse too.

One can only imagine the guilt associated with causing another to lose their life, and it seems Tom Andres wants to reserve that feeling for Laura Bush.

Funny how so many have come on here and said they thought Kennedy was too liberal, but NEVER mention anything that would support that supposition. I guess it's just too easy to say he's too liberal, than to actually exercise any intellectual process to support that idea.

The funny thing is that the man has spent a career pushing legislation that benefits the common folks. I might add that includes most of us posting on this very site.

And speaking of armor, I seem to recall reading articles about the troops having to pay for their own body armor, and all the while, Halliburton was selling the military soda at over 40 dollars a case and providing our troops with contaminated water. Now that seems to be a bigger crime than most things I've read on here, about Kennedy or any one else for that matter.

In closing let me say again, tammer, I have always found your posts well thought out, intelligent and pleasant to read and to the contrary, do not find you to be the dumbest poster on this site. In fact I rank you among the best and brightest of the regulars on here.

It's not easy taking the unpopular view on this site, and when you go against the pack mentality, you find out about it pretty quick.

Tammer, thanks for your ongoing contributions! "

" Although I oppose a huge percentage of Ted Kennedy's political policies, I do not wish him the tragedy of brain cancer. Regarding the 1960's: times were different then. Was Laura Bush drinking before her accident? Probably not, since they were heading TO a party, not FROM one; regardeless, the police didn't automatically consider DUI a factor then. Even a couple decades later, I can attest to the fact that the attitude of law enforcement was different than it is now regarding this situation. As late as 1999, I came out of a convenience store in a wealthy suburb of Dallas, got on my motorcycle, and had obvious problems getting it started and holding the bike up. I did not notice a local cop car parked next to me. After realizing that I was in no condition to ride the bike, the cop approached me and asked me for my license and insurance. After providing the requested documents, the cop noticed that I was a local, and advised that I not ride the bike. He took me to my residence, and warned me that if the bike moved before 2PM, I'd be in trouble. I left the bike in the lot until 7pm the next night, and all was fine. I applaud the officer for his kindness, and never again pulled such an asinine stunt.

Today, for obvious reasons, the rules are different. "

" Hi, Dave, good to hear from you. Your post reminded me of the situation right here in Coles county. When the county boys caught us drinking they just took our booze and sent us on our way with a wink and a lecture. I'm sure all that booze went back to the station house too. In fact back in those days, I seriously doubt if any of the county deputies ever had to pay for booze of any sort. They probably considered it a fringe benefit at the time. LOL! "

" Thanks, HP. I enjoy your posts, not just when you're defending me. :) "

" Rotty, what goes on in the back room at the Ice House that you have spoken of a few times ? "

" In the backroom of the Icehouse is where Rotty,EB,Harry,Dave,Grad,Judge Jacobs,Steve Ferguson,Grady Swinford, and Glasson, all get together and,

Paint Todd Reardon Signs? Who is the hairy legged waiter you like there Harry? Tinkerbell. HAHAHA! "

" Amnesia, eugene?
Ask, mjgtm.
I'm sure it could remind you of your glorious reunions & interludes.

Welcome back, Dally.
Guess Toddy's chances just dropped a few more %s.

Were the inmates allowed a couple of hours of computer time, tonight? "

" Just an idea here, Dally, but I suspect you're doing Reardon more harm than good with your childlike messages on here. "

" For all who don't listen to Pigboy Rush Limbaugh, you don't know what you missed yesterday. Old Pigboy was practically foaming at the mouth in his ravings against Scott McClellan. He was almost hysterical, and was saying things like the book was not written by McClellan but was actually written by George Soros. I laughed so hard, I spilled my drink on my lap. I'm sure Pigboy will still be raving today, so be sure to tune in for more of this comedy. This show makes me really look forward to the day Obama gets elected as the president of the United States. They had better have a Doctor handy for old Pigboy. "

" The kennedy fortune was built on smuggling dope and that is a fact. "

" Old Joe Kennedy made his fortune in the stock market. His sharp eye allowed him to make a fortune as a broker and speculator. He also made money from his investments in movie theater chains and from importing Canadian booze after the end of prohibition. If, as you say, it's a FACT that he made his money from drugs, then you should be able to support that. I serioussly doubt that he would be stupid enough to do that. Perhaps you would care to share your proof of such an asinine claim as that?

I really believe that if you put things on this site, you should be willing to back them up with a credible source.

I'll be waiting. "

" Pigboy will have to see the Kennedys and get some more dope. "

" Soory it was alcohol, not dope , no wait alcohol is liquid dope.

Joseph Kennedy, who was most recognizable as the father of former U.S. President John F. Kennedy, became affectionately known as a Baptist Bootlegger.

By the mid 1920s the Volstead Act was being reviewed by his allies in the American Government with a view to repealing it, but Kennedy was making so much money while prohibition was in existence, that he secretly aligned himself with Temperance Movement supporters in an effort to keep prohibition in place.

With a certain degree of control at that point and insider information during the prohibition period, he positioned himself as the sole import agent of several brands of alcohol, purchasing millions of dollars worth of stock. The day prohibition ended in 1933 his company re-sold the stock legally making tens of millions of dollars of profit.

While subversively controlling the distribution of illegal alcohol during prohibition, Kennedy disguised his activities as the legitimate owner of an investment firm, trading in the largely unregulated stock market.

In what would be considered highly illegal by todays governance of the stock exchange, Joseph Kennedy manipulated the stock values of companies in cooperation with a pool of investors up or down depending on the position of the pool at the time.

In 1928 Kennedy pulled hundreds of millions of dollars out of the markets just prior to the market crash of 1929 and then subsequently made a secondary fortune on his short positions.

A true american hero! "

" Care to list your source of these so-called facts, krusayda? Is it a legitimate historical source, or some rumor-mongering book with unsubstantiated claims made just to make money? There's a whole cottage industry of those when it comes to the Kennedys. You can't believe everything you read, ya know. "

" Now here is a fact about the Bush family fortune. It started with grandpa Bush's business dealing with the Nazi's before WW ll. Grandpa Bush kept dealing with the Nazi's until the US government seized the assets of his company. It is also believed that the Bush family benefited from the use of slave labor in other companies grandpa Prescott had ownership in.

Dealing with the enemy seems to be a Bush family value too, as George W Bush was business partners at least one member of the Ben Laden family in his oil ventures. Ever wonder why Bush loaded the rest of that family on a plane for Saudi Arabia before they could be questioned after 9/11?

As has been stated on here before, the Bush's make the Kennedy's look like a bunch of choir boys by comparison. "

" The back roomm at the Ice House is where Rotty was married to Potter!! This was the first same sex marriage in Coles County. Early Bird was trhe matron of honor. Good luck to the newlyweds!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! "

" Trying to place other's names, into scenarios, for your own short commings, mjgtm?
Guess Toddy's ratings just dropped even lower, if this is the kind of support he has.
Did the jailhouse have romper room hour yesturday?
You redneck rebels showed your true IQ when you opened your mouths up, about Jason, to begin with.
Now, you think you're gaining points, by posting like a ten year old?
Tell ya what, mjgtm, why don't you leave the posting to 85CHSGrad, atleast Grad doesn't post like a child who's lost its pacifier.
Now, here's a tissue mjgtm, I'm sure you could use one after this.
Maybe you could use your one phone call towards a good shrink. "

" I hear that Obama is planning on a Theme of the Kennedy Era during the Dem Convention in Aug in Denver Co. That would be very nice. "

" Better check your MBP's Rotty. or do you not even know what a MBP is? "

" What does Mr. Reardon have to do with this conversation or 85grad. I have never met Reardon. You must have a problem with him and 85grad, but I'll tell you what. Both of these parties have more sense in their postings than you could ever have. Sorry to have busted your bubble idiot!!!!!!!!!!!!! "

" By the way, mjgtm, here's another tissue for ya.
Make sure to use your one phone call wisely.
Now don't forget, help is only a phone call away. "

" Wow, my post before my 11:33pm post didn't make it past the monitor, I guess.
LOL!
Now my 11:33pm post will seem a bit confusing.
LOL!
Alright, I'm going to call this, & let bygones be bygones.
We both disagree with the each other's beliefs.
So, I'm agreeing to disagree with you.
Have a good day & see ya around.

Now, back to the Ted Kennedy topic at hand.... "